Extreme Rules 2016: Extreme Kickouts And Cleaning Supplies

Extreme Rules 2016
Date: May 22, 2016
Location: Prudential Center, Newark, New Jersey
Commentators: Byron Saxton, John Bradshaw Layfield, Michael Cole

It’s a night of rematches but in this case we have a few bonus stipulations to carry things forward. The main event is another match between WWE World Champion Roman Reigns and AJ Styles, in this case under Extreme Rules. The question here is who interferes and helps either guy pull off the win. Let’s get to it.

On the pre-show, here are the Dudley Boyz with something to say. Bubba starts an ECW chant before telling the fans to stop buying everything they’re told to do. Once the Dudley Boyz left ECW, it completely fell apart. As for today, ever since they got here, Bubba has been dying to say something. “D-VON! LET’S GET OUT OF NEW JERSEY!”

Bubba rants about how much he hates the New Era until Big Cass interrupts. After listing off a bunch of food (these jokes lose some of their connection without Enzo), Cass says the New Era is doing what the ECW guys did in Bingo halls but in front of millions of people. A quick brawl breaks out with Cass clearing the ring and calling them S-A-W-F-T.

It was smart to have them doing something here but if Enzo is going to be out much longer, they need to either give Cass a new partner (even a temporary one) or have him do a singles feud. Cass is legitimately hot right now and it would be very risky to waste that while waiting on Enzo, who is probably better suited as a mouthpiece, to come back.

Pre-Show: Dolph Ziggler vs. Baron Corbin

Rubber match because rubber matches are awesome and No DQ. The bell rings nine minutes before the regular show is supposed to start so they’re in a hurry here. Ziggler dropkicks him down but Corbin takes it to the floor and sends Ziggler face first into the post. Back in and Corbin pounds away as Mauro lists off a bunch of biographical facts about Corbin (double degree in college and a Slipknot fan), making me miss the days of Mike Tenay doing the same thing in WCW. I know it’s nothing all that interesting but it lets you know a few things about the guy.

Corbin’s chinlock goes nowhere as Dolph gets in a jawbreaker and clothesline to take over. The Stinger Splash into a neckbreaker gets no cover as the countdown to the pay per view reminds us that this is in fact heavily scripted and certainly won’t go over because that’s how wrestling works. Corbin’s powerbomb is countered into a sunset flip for two, followed by a Deep Six for the same on Dolph. Ziggler grabs a tornado DDT and the Fameasser for two and both guys are down. The superkick misses and Corbin hits him low, which FINALLY plays into the rules. End of Days gives Baron the pin at 7:58.

Rating: D+. It’s not so much the action itself but more along the lines of how weak the gimmick stuff was here. They had a total of one instance of using the rules (the posting early on is marginal at best) and that’s not something that should happen in a No DQ match. It doesn’t help that this didn’t need such a gimmick but the calendar insisted on it and we certainly can’t question that.

The other issue here, and this one is certainly not their fault, is the time. That clock on the screen kept letting you know that it would be over soon and really took me out of the match more than once. This should have started about ten to fifteen minutes earlier so they could have had the extra time to let this build up. It never ceases to amaze me that WWE, who OWNS THE NETWORK AND HAS AS MUCH TIME AS THEY WANT, can’t time this stuff better. It really is inexcusable and yet it never stops happening.

The opening video talks about how rules control us but tonight is the chance to write our own rules.

Karl Anderson/Luke Gallows vs. Usos

Texas Tornado rules and this is their fifth match in less than a month, not counting six man tags. It’s a brawl in the aisle to start with the Usos getting the better of it, despite certainly not being the most popular guys in the building tonight. Jey dives over the top to take out Gallows, followed by a high cross body for two on Anderson. JBL calls this a dream match, which might have been true on the first match or maybe even the second. I lost interest somewhere around the third but I’m not smart enough to keep up with WWE booking.

Something like the Boot of Doom off the apron blasts Jimmy and the Club takes over. The Usos fight out of what looked like a Doomsday Device and it’s Jey dropkicking Gallows into a rollup for two. Anderson comes back in and knees Jey so hard that he holds his foot before getting two. Jimmy breaks up the Boot of Doom but the Superfly Splash gets the same treatment.

A Whisper in the Wind misses and it’s the Gallows Pole to Jimmy, followed by a spinebuster for two on Jey. Anderson sends Jey outside but charges into a superkick, setting up the running Umaga Attack against the barricade. Gallows is back up with a clothesline (JBL: “LARIOTO!”) and grabs the bell (insert your own Festus joke), only to eat a superkick from Jimmy. The Superfly Splash only hits the bell though and the Magic Killer pins Jimmy at 8:32.

Rating: B-. The match was fun but again, I lost all my interest in seeing these two teams fight weeks ago. It also helped that they were going somewhere with the rules being changed, basically starting the standard tag finishing formula at the beginning of the match. This was fine but they both really need to move on.

The Usos are helped out, which is mentioned as having a factor on the main event.

We get a quick recap of the main event with Rusev injuring Kalisto on Raw to make this even more one sided on paper.

US Title: Rusev vs. Kalisto

Kalisto is defending and tries to start fast with the corkscrew cross body, only to have it knocked out of the air with an ax handle. The fans are split on Rusev (now there’s something you don’t often see) as he pounds Kalisto down. We hit the bearhug and a CM Punk chant starts up. Kalisto fights out of a torture rack and counters into a sleeper with Rusev looking more shocked than worried. The hold goes nowhere so the champ grabs a tornado DDT (second of the night) and now the corkscrew connects.

There’s the hurricanrana driver for two, followed by a hurricanrana through the ropes to send Rusev face first into the steps. Back in and Rusev escapes the Salida Del Sol so Kalisto scores with a moonsault to take him down again. Kalisto goes up but Rusev slams him off the top and right onto the apron to stop Kalisto cold. The doctor comes out to check on him so Rusev grabs the Accolade, bending Kalisto back so far that Rusev is on his back, easily making Kalisto tap at 9:30.

Rating: C. That stuff with the doctor had me worried that they might actually keep the title on Rusev here. There was no reason to not change the title here, especially with Cena coming back in a week on Memorial Day. I really wish they had done something more with Kalisto but the curse of the midcard title got to him again, which really is a shame as it’s taken down so many people now.

Trailer for Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles 2, featuring Sheamus.

We recap the Tag Team Titles match with the old school Vaudevillains winning a tournament to earn this title shot against New Day. This included New Day building a time machine, which was NOT an empty refrigerator box.

Tag Team Titles: New Day vs. Vaudevillains

New Day is defending but first they have something to say. After insisting that it was NOT a refrigerator box, Woods implies that he could use some photos or videos on his private feed. Big E. tries to cut him off but Woods insists that he get to shoot his shot. Fans: “SHOOT HIS SHOT!” Big E. has some gardening tools with them and since they’re in the Garden State, it’s time to put some hoes in the ground.

Kofi is the odd man out here which you don’t see that often. The champs get jumped to start and Woods is sent into the post to give the Vaudevillains early control. Gotch comes in for something like a dragon sleeper but Woods gets out and blasts him with a jumping enziguri.

The hot(ish) tag brings in Big E. for some house cleaning in the form of some belly to belly suplexes. It’s quickly back to Woods though with Big E. being sent into the steps. The Whirling Dervish only gets two on Woods and Big E. gets back in to spear English through the ropes. Kofi interferes with a kick to Gotch’s head and Woods adds a Shining Wizard for the pin on Simon at 6:13.

Rating: C-. In theory this sets up Gallows/Anderson as the serious challengers but this really didn’t do anything for me. For one thing, it’s really not making sense to have the face champions use the numbers advantage. It’s against logic in wrestling and needs to stop happening. It’s not like Big E. and Kofi can’t pull this off on their own. On top of that, this was just a six minute match after a pretty strong build with the Vaudevillains being treated like the young guys they really are. I wasn’t feeling this one but it seems like a one off match.

AJ says he’ll win tonight and walks into the Club dressing room.

We recap the Intercontinental Title match with Miz defending against Sami Zayn, Cesaro and Kevin Owens. They’ve done a great job of setting up the four way feud with everyone going after each other and having a reason to want to fight their opponents. Basically Sami vs. Kevin and Cesaro vs. Miz were combined into one feud to this is the big blowoff.

Intercontinental Title: The Miz vs. Kevin Owens vs. Cesaro vs. Sami Zayn

Miz is defending and this is one fall to a finish. Sami hits a Helluva Kick on Owens at the bell and Kevin falls outside. Cesaro uppercuts Miz and we’ve got a good guy showdown early on. Sami starts in on the still bad shoulder before kicking Cesaro in the face for two. That’s enough for Cesaro as he grabs a tilt-a-whirl backbreaker for two of his own and Sami is in trouble. Back up and Sami low bridges Cesaro out to the floor as Miz comes back in, only to be clotheslined outside.

Byron tries to call the match but JBL says if Saxton was on life support, he’d unplug the cord and charge his iPhone. Ok, can we PLEASE cut out the JBL doesn’t like Byron stuff? They’ve been going with it for like ever now and since it’s certainly not leading to a match or likely anything, drop it already as it’s been old but just keeps going for no reason other than picking on Byron. Sami flip dives onto Miz and Cesaro to put all three down. Back in and we almost get a Tower of Doom until Owens runs in for the save.

Kevin cleans house and gets two off the backsplash to Sami. The frog splash is broken up by Miz though and now we get the Tower of Doom with Owens getting the worst of it as Cesaro powerbombs everyone down. Sami knees his way out of Cesaro’s suplex and the Blue Thunder Bomb gets two. Miz grabs an exploder suplex on Sami but Cesaro suplexes both of them at once because he’s just that awesome.

All four are down in a corner now and that means it’s time for the running uppercuts all around. Kevin stops Cesaro though and it’s Cannonballs for everyone. Sami breaks that up though, only to eat Swiss Death. The Skull Crushing Finale gets two on Cesaro and everyone is down. Miz yells at Cesaro for kicking out and makes the mistake of slapping him in the face, setting up the springboard corkscrew uppercut to the champ.

That means it’s time for the Cesaro Swing for over twenty seconds, followed by the Sharpshooter. The rope break doesn’t exist in a four way so Maryse has to offer a distraction while Miz taps. You would think the referee, two feet away from Miz, would have heard that but instead Owens has to make a save. Miz grabs the ropes to block another Swing and Owens dives in with a frog splash to the elevated champion.

The Neutralizer gets two on Owens with Sami diving in at the very last moment for the save. Cesaro’s powerbomb to Sami is countered into a very fast sunset flip for two. Cesaro BLASTS him with an uppercut but walks into an exploder suplex into the corner, only to have Owens come in with the Pop Up Powerbomb for two on Cesaro with Miz making the save.

Owens yells at Maryse and gets a Skull Crushing Finale on the floor, only to have Miz dive in for two more on Cesaro. These near falls are insane. Fans: “FIGHT FOREVER!” Miz is backdropped out to the floor but Cesaro turns around and eats the Helluva Kick for two with Owens making a save this time. While the two of them fight, Miz slides in and steals the pin on Cesaro to retain at 18:20.

Rating: A. This was some of the best timing I’ve ever seen in a multi-man match with the near falls getting me more than once. It’s not often that I get fooled by some near falls but this match did it multiple times in less than twenty minutes. I had a great time watching this and the storytelling at the end with Sami getting obsessed with Owens and costing him the title as a result.

Pre-show chat.

We recap Dean Ambrose vs. Chris Jericho in an Asylum match (cage with weapons). They had a match at Payback with Dean winning clean so Jericho hit him in the head with Dean’s potted plant (Mitch). Dean then ripped up Jericho’s $15,000 jacket and the result is this match.

Dean Ambrose vs. Chris Jericho

There are weapons around the top of the cage, you win by pin or submission and Jericho is in boots and jeans. Jericho quickly takes him down to start but Dean makes a quick save and sends Jericho into the cage. It’s time for the first weapon so Dean grabs….a mop, which he uses to blast Jericho in the ear. Cole: “He’s looking to mop up Jericho here.” Even Byron rips on him for a line that bad.

Jericho scores with a dropkick to take over but takes too long going up, allowing Dean to belly to back superplex him down. Both guys go up and it’s Dean coming back with nunchucks, only to have Jericho grab a barbed wire 2×4. That goes nowhere so they both climb up with Jericho getting in a few kendo stick shots to put Dean back in the ring. The crowd isn’t exactly thrilled by this.

Now some nunchuck shots have Dean in trouble and Jericho makes it even worse (I think?) by grabbing a leather strap. A whip to the head doesn’t have much effect so Dean flips him off the top to put both guys down again. Dean straps him a few times but gets sent into the cage. Jericho climbs up but Dean is on the top rope to crotch him back down. Dean pulls off a fire extinguisher so Jericho throws a straitjacket over his head and gets two off an enziguri.

Thankfully Chris gets smart and ties Dean in the straitjacket…..which he doesn’t tie. Dean pops up with forearms which don’t wake the crowd up so a clothesline gets two instead. A butterfly backbreaker gets two for Jericho and the fans want Ryder. Dean drops him again and climbs to the top of the cage for the standing elbow drop and almost no reaction. Like you would think it was a clothesline for a meaningless one count a minute into the match.

Since this hasn’t gone on long enough, Dean goes up to get a mop bucket. That gets no reaction either but the bag of thumbtacks inside gets a bit better reception. They tease going into the tacks multiple times each until they give up for the time being, killing the crowd again.

The Lionsault hits knees but Jericho counters Dirty Deeds into the Walls. That goes nowhere (of course) so Dean breaks a kendo stick over Jericho’s back. Chris saves himself with a fire extinguisher blast, setting up the Codebreaker for two. Some barbed wire 2×4 shots to Dean’s ribs have almost no effect as he counters another Codebreaker by dropping Jericho onto the tacks. Now THAT woke the crowd up. Dirty Deeds ends Jericho at a ridiculous 26:23.

Rating: D+. I think you can guess my biggest issue with this match. Dean vs. Jericho third from the top in a semi-comedy cage match on a gimmick pay per view shouldn’t be 45 seconds shorter than the main event of Wrestlemania. The crowd just did not care here and they lost me as soon as the mop came into play. How much hatred and anger can you have in a match where the big violence for the first twenty five minutes is a mop to the head? Oh and they didn’t even use the plant, which was the big idea of the match. I really wasn’t feeling this one and it just went on WAY too long, even though it was a decent brawl at times.

We recap the Women’s Title, which is somehow centered around Ric Flair. Natalya made the champ tap but Flair distracted the referee so Charlotte could escape. Therefore the result is a submission match with Flair barred from ringside.

Women’s Title: Charlotte vs. Natalya

Charlotte is defending and this is a submission match. Natalya takes her down by the ankle to start and asks where Ric is now. A surfboard has the champ in even more trouble but she rolls out to the floor and fires off some chops. That’s fine with Natalya who sends Charlotte shoulder first into the post to give her a new target. Back in and Charlotte kicks her in the face but gets rolled up into a cross armbreaker. I can always go for some basic psychology like that.

Charlotte gets up and powerbombs Natalya to break the hold before grabbing something like a reverse Figure Four (with Natalya on her stomach and Charlotte on her back). Natalya crawls to the ropes and out of the ring for the break as the rope beak rule still isn’t clear over the years.

Charlotte scores with the moonsault and puts on a half crab but Natalya (with her leg just fine) pops up and throws her down with a German suplex. The Sharpshooter goes on so Charlotte climbs the ropes…..which doesn’t work as she crashes back to the mat. Cue a fake Ric Flair which is revealed to be…..Dana Brooke. The distraction lets Charlotte get in a cheap shot and put on the Figure Eight for the submission at 9:34.

Rating: D+. Well that was nothing and so much for the women stealing the show at every pay per view. I didn’t see any selling in this (Natalya being on her feet after the leg work and Charlotte’s arm being fine for the Figure Eight) and the ending was stupid. Somewhat predictable as you knew something was going to happen (though Dana was a surprise) but stupid at the same time. I don’t know if I just died in that marathon cage match or in the fact that Natalya was clearly just a filler opponent but I really wasn’t feeling this one.

Flair, Dana and Charlotte celebrate post match. Cole thinks this was a set up because Cole is forced to sound like a stupid puppet.

We recap the World Title match, which is a Payback rematch after AJ won by countout and DQ but the match was restarted twice, allowing Reigns to pin him. Since then AJ has been forced to go extreme against his will but eventually he seemed to like the idea. There’s still the question of whether or not he’s been behind the Club attacks but that hasn’t been treated as such an important idea this time around.

WWE World Title: Roman Reigns vs. AJ Styles

AJ is challenging and this is under Extreme Rules, meaning street fight. Styles tells him to bring it to start so Reigns elbows him in the face. AJ ducks some shots and fires off kicks, which are quickly shoved away so Roman can fire off corner clotheslines. A big jumping knee to the face knocks AJ silly and they head outside.

Reigns takes too long setting up the announcers’ table though and gets knocked into the crowd. They fight over to the pre-show panel with AJ throwing him into various objects, including the table and a barricade wall. The Phenomenal Forearm off the table just staggers Reigns and they fight back to the timekeeper’s area. AJ sends him into the post and peels back the floor pads, which can never go well.

The Styles Clash on the concrete is of course countered so AJ tries it on the announcers’ table. Reigns counters that as well and catches a charging AJ in a big old backdrop through the other announcers’ table. Fans: “YOU STILL SUCK!” Back in and Reigns hits a Razor’s Edge into a sitout powerbomb (that should be someone’s finisher) for two and the champ is shocked.

With little else working, Reigns loads up the Superman Punch but AJ hits him in the knee and Reigns buckles to the mat. AJ knees him in the face from the apron but Reigns catches him in a powerbomb (so much for the leg) through the other announcers’ table (with AJ bouncing on the table before it breaks). The spear only hits the barricade though and Reigns is out.

They very slowly get back up and it’s AJ trying the Phenomenal Forearm with Reigns Superman Punching him in the face for the counter. The spear connects off the steps but neither guy can get up. Cue the Club as AJ is thrown back inside. Now this brings up the question: who am I supposed to cheer for here? Cole acts like this is a big heel act but Reigns is hardly a good guy.

The Boot of Doom only gives AJ two (so much for that move meaning anything) but the Usos run out (so much for that angle earlier in the night) for the superkick party. Jimmy’s Superfly Splash gives Reigns an obvious two. Another spear is countered and AJ scores with the Clash for two. The Superman Punch is countered again with an enziguri and the Styles Clash on the chair gets two more. Oh come on now. AJ is stunned so he unloads on the Usos and Reigns with the chair. Another Phenomenal Forearm is countered and a single spear retains the title at 22:13.

Rating: B+. This was really good, crippling the Styles Clash aside. It certainly wasn’t one sided but I have a real hard time buying Reigns kicking out of all the offense before the run-ins, the Boot of Doom, two Styles Clashes and a bunch of chair shots. At some point it gets stupid and we hit that with about five minutes to go. Either way though, this was another really good brawl as they beat each other up for a long time before the finishing sequence that people weren’t interested in seeing. I don’t think anyone expected AJ to win here and that’s fine, but good grief enough with killing the Styles Clash.

Post match Seth Rollins makes his return and lays out Reigns with a Pedigree. I have no idea if that makes him a heel or a face but I don’t think WWE does either.

Overall Rating: B. The strong matches more than carry this show as you had the amazing fourway, the strong main event and a good opener to balance out the WAY too long (though certainly not horrible) cage match. The show was very up and down though and instead of leading up to a big ending, it was much more “here’s something good now here’s something bad.” Thankfully it looks like we’re setting up some fresh stuff with Money in the Bank in a month, but that show tends to just throw everyone together in one big mess and forget all the feuds. Still though, strong show and outstanding if you cut out one match.

Results

Karl Anderson/Luke Gallows b. Usos – Magic Killer to Jimmy

Rusev b. Kalisto – Accolade

New Day b. Vaudevillains – Shining Wizard to Gotch

Miz b. Cesaro, Kevin Owens and Sami Zayn – Miz pinned Cesaro after a Helluva Kick from Zayn

Dean Ambrose b. Chris Jericho – Dirty Deeds

Charlotte b. Natalya – Figure Eight

Roman Reigns b. AJ Styles – Spear

Remember to follow me on Twitter @kbreviews and pick up my new book on NXT: The Full Sail Years Volume II at Amazon for just $3.99 at:

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47 comments

  1. Thadzo says:

    You seem quite unimpressed with the thumbtacks, but isn’t that kind of a big deal for the current WWE era? My brother (who just started watching WWE with this year’s Wrestlemania) really despises Dean Ambrose, but still liked the match because of the thumbtack spots.

    Though maybe that’s on me, for overselling the “WWE hates blood now and those thumbtacks are obviously just a tease” angle…

  2. Scott says:

    You contradicting yourself is one of the only entertaining things left about your reviews. This is from your Mania 32 review: ROAR! THEY TOTALLY KILLED THE STYLES CLASH!!! EVERY TIME SOMEONE KICKS OUT OF A FINISHER IT CAN NEVER BE USED AGAIN!!! ROAR I SAY! Typical response I’ve seen to that near fall and as usual, wrestling fans need to calm down because it means nothing.

    Have a good day.

    Thadzo Reply:

    I’d assumed they killed the move early because it’s so unsafe, and Jericho was the guy to kill it because he’s enough of a veteran not to get hurt by it. I’m more surprised that it was even performed than that it didn’t get the pin.

    Greg Reply:

    They can always build a move back up but they did it hurt for the short term. Long term, it will be fine. Kicking out of it on a chair is a tad ridiculous.

    JR has said in the past that kicking out of too many things is akin to cheating. Way too many things were kicked out of in the match (not just the Clash).

    If the move was unsafe, they wouldn’t do it in the first place. AJ has said he is fine without it. It honestly doesn’t even look that good anyways.

    larisano Reply:

    Totally agreed on that. The guy who kicked out of it tonight is the current Top guy in the WWE. Don’t see the big issue in him kicking out the Styles Clash at all.

    Greg Reply:

    It was more he kicked out after 2 Clashes, chair shots and whatever Gallows/Carl’s finisher is. That is a lot to kick out of.

    Take The Shield. They rarely lost in 6 man tag matches. No matter who they faced. They wouldn’t have been nearly as good if they lost a bunch of times. Apply that to a finisher. If a finish always ends a match then every time it is hit, you’ll go oh crap it’s over. When a finish is kicked out of like this you’ll go eh until it is built back up.

    klunderbunker Reply:

    This. One Clash would have been fine if not expected. It’s three finishers, one of which on a chair, after twenty minutes of hard brawling.

    ted Reply:

    Even if he is the top guy so what? It doesn’t do a.j. any favors. Roman is going to be protected anyhow so why do it? Why not save it for someone who does need a rub that way?

    Also don’t kid yourself Roman is not going to be the top guy the way Austin Hogan or even Cena was. I’d be surprised if this experiment lasts the year.

    If the ratings continue to go down and they continue to lose money. They are going to have to make a change.

  3. ted says:

    The show was meh. The 4 way intercontinental title match was awesome.

    The main event was good. Roman still sucks. Was Seth’s return supposed to be a heel turn? A face turn?

    Greg Reply:

    I’m guessing he is a heel. A face wouldn’t have attacked him like that. Similar thing happened with Ryback/Cena when Ryback turned.

    ted Reply:

    Thing is that isn’t how it came off. As far as most people are concerned. Seth just knocked out the heel everyone can’t stand.

    Marky-Marc Reply:

    @Ted

    Reigns is a face. The person who sneak-attacks him from behind after a match is a heel. Regardless of who the fans are cheering for, that is how it goes.

    ted Reply:

    2 problems with that

    1. it’s not even true. The audience dicates who is a face and who is a heel. if it doesn’t work you change it

    2. He doesn’t wrestle like a face and doesn’t even identify as such himself. He is being presented like a heel. If he is supposed to be a face he’s garbage at it.

    ted Reply:

    “dictates”

  4. Jay H (the real one) says:

    Is the Styles Clash really that impressive when you look at the move? Sure it’s cool he’s still able to use it when we should be glad he is but I like the Forearm being used more as AJ’s finisher. It’s a better visual when he’s flying through the air IMO.

    Overall a very good PPV with a strong Main Event (though I guess im not surprised people chant you still suck at Reigns even when he’s breaking out new stuff he doesn’t normally do but such is life with 2016 Wrestling Fans). Glad that Seth Rollins is back and that 4 Way for the IC Title is easily a MOTY Candidate right now.

    ted Reply:

    It’s because he’s boring and his character is not working and the company is not addressing it. Fans don’t like being insulted. Imagine that.

    Jay H (the real one) Reply:

    I think that they have addressed it and I don’t think it matters what reaction he gets at this point because he’s going to be the man. Imagine that.

    ted Reply:

    Ah and how did they address it?

    It does matter because it’s going to lead to problems in fact it already has. It make the company look tone deaf and out of touch. Ratings are down, revenue is down. Now this isn’t entirely Roman’s fault. But he’s not helping. The guy is not working in the role he’s in. If the company could just accept that and try something else it would be fine.

    Roman will never be the guy they want in the role he’s in. I don’t care how many people he beats, I don’t care how many title runs he gets, I don’t care how many smug promos he shoots. he’s not going to be the next john cena level star.

    ted Reply:

    Why would you fight your audience? No other company does this.

    The wwe says Roman Reigns is a star the guy the show should be based around. Fans all over the world say no he isn’t. We don’t like him we want insert other wrestler name in his place. They say that’s nice continue roman push.

    It makes no sense. Push guys the audience likes as faces. Push guys the audience dislikes as heels. This isn’t hard. People are leaving the audiences are getting smaller. They feel like nothing they do will matter. So why watch?

    Jay H (the real one) Reply:

    Yeah because listening to Fans all the time will get you so far. There are a few exceptions but not everyone wants the same thing all the time. The audiences are getting smaller? They had another sellout last night. Not sure what you’re looking at.

    Also if you are that unhappy then turn it off.

    Ted Reply:

    I can link you if you like to the gates shrinking over the last 4 years. female demographic is holding males over 25 is shrinking. No the company is not making as much over the last five years. You think Vince sold stock because business is good? Don’t be naive.

    Also using your own logic. You don’t like what I’m writing don’t read it.

    I however will watch for the parts I do like and point out the flaws in the parts I don’t. I don’t know where you got miserable. I don’t like the reigns character and it does annoy me. But I’d hardly say it makes me miserable.

    If every arena they go to boos reigns to where they have to mute the mice. You have failed to make a baby face.

    BSE Reply:

    Roman Reigns doesn’t have a character. His mic skills suck. That’s why people don’t like him.

    Greg Reply:

    Couldn’t the same be said for Styles?

    Ted Reply:

    No because he’s being cheered. He’s getting the reaction he’s supposed to. Also reigns and styles are equal on the mic

    Greg Reply:

    That was my point. They are both the same on the mic. They are both capable in ring (Styles is better but Reigns is growing).

    I’m not the biggest fan of either guy (I favor entertainment over in-ring ability). They both have the same weaknesses yet one is hated and the other is loved.

    Greg Reply:

    I also want to address WWE’s business being bad.

    Let’s take 2011-2015 and compare it to the Attitude Era years (97-98 through 01-02, WWE use to start their statement years a few months into the year hence 97-98 being a starting point). WWE’s revenue has been higher each year from 11-15 than during the AE. The higest revenue made during the AE was $456 million while the lowest made since 2011 was $481 million. 2015’s revenue was the highest in their history ($658 million). The AE obliterates the past few years in regard to income ($189 million AE vs $27 million 11-15). The big reason for that is the Network (the costs for that started in 2011). The startup costs for that were enormous along with taking awhile to hit their break even subscriber point. The movie division probably also hurt them as well but I don’t feel like looking into that (there was a $23 million loss in their movie divison in 2011).

    WWE is actually doing better than ever in revenue but their costs are also high. Looking at it in black and white would suggest the AE did way better. But that isn’t the case. WWE also didn’t have to battle things like piracy, streaming, 5 billion other TV channels as much as they do now. Combine that with the Network and that gives a pretty good explanation for their drop in income. The product not being the best doesn’t help but there are more factors than just the product.

    Greg Reply:

    Oops, I meant the income was $189 million AE vs $51 million 11-15.

  5. Your Eternal Reward says:

    That is what i fucking hate about Roman’s booking, don’t have him take several finishers in a row, stand up and hit a spear for the easy pin fall.

    It just makes everyone but Roman look like shit. Instead of a fucking spear why not having the spear lead into a strong power move like a powerbomb or some kind of high impact suplex. The spear should not be ending matches.

  6. Aeon Mathix says:

    I’m not sure why but I seem to have lost all interest in Dean Ambrose. How much did that Lesnar squash damage Dean KB?

    klunderbunker Reply:

    A lot. This Jericho feud has helped but a win over Jericho is almost like a participation badge. At some point, Dean needs to win something of value and a cage match against Jericho isn’t it.

    larisano Reply:

    Why did the Ambrose-Y2J feud fall so flat? It wasn’t the worst ever but it can’t be denied that it was still terrible overall.

    Really letdown since it was the kind of feud I expected to be top notch when it was teased around NoC last yr.

  7. Marky-Marc says:

    The Asylum match was doomed from the beginning for a few reasons. First, it went immediately after the awesome IC Title match. Very tough to follow. Second, I think the crowd knew the ending wasn’t coming until all or most of the hanging weapons were used. It’s like what Foley said about his Cell match with HHH: when the crowd knows it’s not the end of the match they’re not going to get too excited. Once the tacks came out you knew we were close.

    I enjoyed the main event, overbooking aside. Some of the spots were impressive and I think it came out better than I was expecting.

    Good call on the Miz retain. His reign has been short but I think it’s been built up to the point where a loss is going to mean a good rub for someone else.

    New Day gets seven minutes? Really?

    If Rollins is cleared from ACL/MCL surgery in just six months, he might be more of a freak than Cena.

    Greg Reply:

    6 months is actually when you are cleared after ACL surgery (takes 6 months for the ACL to reattach). Usually people will take 7-12 months to get their strength back. Pro athletes like Rollins will usually do a different more intensive rehab so they can come back at 6 months. No reason for a normal person to do the intensive version hence the longer recovery time.

  8. klunderbunker says:

    I’m thinking I need to do some more talking on this Reigns thing but the post match stuff was……odd.

    On one hand, yeah Rollins returned as a heel in WWE’s eyes. I don’t think that’s really up for debate.

    On the other hand, he’s at least a borderline face in the fans’ eyes because the fans don’t want to cheer Reigns right now.

    A lot of it is going to be determined by his promo tomorrow.

  9. klunderbunker says:

    Here’s the thing: you can’t listen to your audience all the time. Now yes, there are certainly instances like Daniel Bryan and CM Punk where you have to push people at certain times and it makes sense. However, listening to the crowd universally isn’t the best idea in the world, because the audience in the arena is a lot smaller than the audience around the world.

    In Reigns’ case though, I’m really not sure what they’re going with here. Reigns as the top face clearly isn’t working at this point, but at least the tweener push has started. There’s definitely a lot of talent there but there are still some major changes that need to take place.

  10. Big Ell says:

    Fun recap of a show I was glad to be in attendance for.

    Small note. Crowd was saying “We Want Rollins” during the Asylum match, not Ryder. Did you hear a “Fight Forever” chant akin to NXT Takeover? I sure didn’t in the live crowd. I’ll probably be watching that 4 Way again though anyway so I’ll listen for it!

    klunderbunker Reply:

    Rollins makes more sense.

    Yeah it wasn’t very strong but it was definitely there.

  11. Bloodbuzz Bunk says:

    I agree with everything you said except for the Asylum match and the main event.

    Firstly bless all four IC title participants for basically deeming to make that belt mean something again without the cheap tricks of having a main event star give it some juice and abandon it. Rusev also needs to be seriously pushed with US title instead of feed to Cena but I’m not optimistic in that regard.

    Poor Vaudvillians, Get better Enzo so you and Cass can solidify the tag team division.

    Now to in regards to the Asylum, I agree with Marky-Marc about it’s position on the card and the inherent sobering effects of what was essentially 10 Hanging Chekov’s guns. But it was about 5-8 minutes to long and if they just would have let them bleed it would have appeased the smarky crowd in NJ. But my argument here is that it can be a match with serious violence and comedic elements. It’s funny to hear Jericho complain about the mop or the whole Ambrose is secretly proficient with nunchucks without diminishing the fact that they hate each other for other reason that each of them keeps escalating a silly reason to feud because they are both proud and crazy. I would give it a B.

  12. Bloodbuzz Bunk says:

    Now to the Main Event. The first one was an A and that felt like an A to me too. I understand the essence of the collective complaints about devaluing the Styles Clash but honestly it is a move WWE never really cared to promote. They like the Phenomenal Forearm and Calf Crusher better for obvious safety reasons and the fact that AJ is shorter than half the roster so it makes the Clash look a little forced.

    But let’s look objectively at the big spots each guy took and kicked out of. Aj takes an insane back body drop through an announce table( the air he got was abnormal) and a sweet Splash Mountain Bomb from Reigns and kicks out. AJ then proceeds to take( in the highlight of match spot wise) a swing into the apron, swing into a barricade, and launched powerbomb through an announce table, a dangerous superman punch spot on the top rope mid springboard, and a launched spear over the steps on the floor.

    So basically AJ was getting crushed with some of the most awesome tough spots I have seen on the main roster in the last few years in a non Lesnar match. The Club enters and Reigns who has taken a few kicks and suplex into the turnbuckle basically kicks out of a Boot of Doom which a signature move of the Club not a finisher( bear with me). AJ takes 4 superkicks and a frog splash and kicks out. Then the two style clash kick outs and AJ is finally put down on a great Spear off a springboard. I’m sorry AJ took 80% of the bumps and it made sense that he lost. It wasn’t like “Roman overcomes the odds” as much as Roman dominated and when all hell broke loose AJ almost got him. Add on the awesome moment where AJ finally snaps and hits the Usos and Reigns with a chair 4 times each in like 15 seconds and the frenzy the crowd was in and this is an A if not a MOTY candidate.

    Ted Reply:

    Reigns gets to spear someone seconds after taking crushing chairs shots. It seemed out of place and ruined the flow to me.

    Ted Reply:

    Also how many arenas does reings have to be booed out of until the smark argument doesn’t hold water anymore?

  13. Dragon says:

    I thought it was a good PPV….and for the people still bitching about the Reigns push, quit watching if you don’t like it…..I don’t like it much but I can accept it just like every other show I watch where I don’t like a plot element, I may not like it but I will keep watching. Back in the 80’s I hated the Hogan push but I accepted it and kept watching. In the end it is their show to run and they are not losing THAT much to warrant a referendum on the issue.

    Dragon Reply:

    and btw I am in no way comparing Hogan to Reigns

    klunderbunker Reply:

    That helps a bit.

    The difference is Hogan came with mainstream acceptance and INSANE upside (the NBC deal that continues to this day can heavily be attributed to him), plus an entirely new generation and style of wrestling.

    Reigns is just a guy. That’s the the thing: there’s really nothing special about him or anything that stands out. He’s gotten MUCH better on the mic and can more than hold his own in the ring, but I have no reason to care about him. Someone like Hogan was so different from anyone else that you had to notice. Reigns is just a big power guy and that’s been done many times before.

    There’s definitely something to Reigns and anyone who thinks he doesn’t have a place in WWE is crazy. However, he isn’t working as the mega face of the company.

    Ted Reply:

    Lol or I could keep pointing out what I don’t like about reigns while enjoying other aspects of the show.

    Also they are losing money and ratings. Not entirely reigns fault. But he isn’t the answer either.

    Dragon Reply:

    I agree with u Ted….he doesn’t seem to be THE guy…….but he is getting a huge reaction….not a face reaction, but a huge one nonetheless, as long as he gets a response of any kind the E will continue on with him. Until Rollins dethrones him of course.

  14. Bloodbuzz Bunk says:

    I never said the man was a good babyface he is as naturally suited as a monster/enforcer/heater type if I have ever seen one. That’s why when he is just screaming, grunting, and destroying things he gets popular. He did that in the Shield and it occasionally takes hold when he isn’t hogging all the WWE Title oxygen and pretending to be an underdog. He was born on third base but comes off like he thinks he hit a 2 out walk off homerun. Which is why its cool that they are playing with this heel turn. However, fair is fair and AJ kicked out of as much if not more rough looking stuff and Reigns hit a desperation spear from his knees essentially. I’m going to get as worked up about it as apparently 90% of the internet did and let it ruin a GREAT MATCH.

    Post Mania I put the over the under of great World Title feuds/matches in Reign’s likely 9-12 month reign at 1. I have been pleasantly surprised at how his reign has exceeded my expectations at this point.